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 Post subject: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Tue 26 Jan, 2016 12:14 pm 
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So does this game looks like it will be particularly well suited to some type of VR head gear, or Augmented reality glasses?
Does anyone have, or know of, a really good headset?

I have been watching this one:

https://www.vuzix.com/Products/iWear-Video-Headphones

At around $500, thats the price of 3 pretty good 24" monitors/TVs.

So now the question is... Do I spend $500 on a heads up VR display like the Vuzix, or the Oculus Rift when it comes out, or go with a 3 monitor set up with some cheaper, 1080P HDTV sets?
Not sure how you would go about hooking up 3 monitors for the game, but that might help with free look controls.

Also, I read somewhere that Windows7 supports some console controllers, like the Xbox. I don't think a Keyboard Mouse interface is going to allow me enough control to do some of the more complex tasks, considering the dozens of keys needed, with either addition monitors, or a VR headset with head tracking...
Maybe going with a VR headset with head tracker will off-load some of those functions?


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Tue 26 Jan, 2016 10:21 pm 
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i might say a monitor for about $175 is decent, but not pretty good. i guess it depends upon how picky someone is, and 24" is probably doable at HD resolution, so maybe.

i am not sure those vr setups are really ready yet. if you get one, it probablly should be occulus rift. i have not looked at others.

Hudson might know something though.

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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Wed 27 Jan, 2016 3:18 pm 
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as far as star citizen is concerned, they WILL have VR support as well as other devices for head tracking and probably other things that come out. right now though they are not planning on implementing these things into star citizen until it gets further along. from what i understand, even though Cryengine supports things like Track IR and other head tracking gear. they have modified it so much it not really the same game engine now. some of the Devs have been jokingly calling it star-engine lol. (its probably why they have so many of the developers who created cryengine, now on the CIG staff.) so what i think has happened in the case of track IR, is that the game engine has been modified to the point where having that support enabled started causing problems in the development. so i believe their plan is to continue the development and then come back and fix the VR and track IR issues once they get the majority of the game engine where they want it.

so the impression that i got is that it will be awhile before these devices will be working in SC. however i know of quite a few players who have 3 monitors setup and they seem to love em. i know there are a lot of tutorials on how best to setup a tri-monitor gaming setup on youtube. from what i understand you will need a hell of a beefy video card to run the tri-monitor setup. im just unsure of the details.

i tried to run double monitors for awhile. it was interesting, for me it was so i could play the game while watching streams or to have something else up. what i found on my wimpy 750ti card was, it seemed to take a pretty good performance hit.

as for the controllers i think the corded X-box controllers work ok in SC. not sure about the other ones though. i do know that they make PC controllers like the console ones that you can use. i used to have one but now its parts for my frankenstick experiment (:: insert evil laugh here:: )

hope this helps some.


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Sat 06 Feb, 2016 12:26 am 
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Yeah probly the best bet is to wait. That stuff always gets cheaper over time. I see the Vuzix iWear website went live.
https://www.vuzix.com/Products/iWear-Video-Headphones
2-4 week delivery, same $500 price tag. Can't tell if there are add ons you have to also buy or if it comes with everything for that $500. If they keep selling out, I might buy some of their stocks lol. (edit, I did snag some shares.)
So not completely off topic, I was able to play for a good couple hours tonight. I did't modify my guns, so just the stock cannons and repeaters. I suspect changing weapons made my ship glitch and crash (game crash) prone. Anyway, after a few fights without dying and a few repairs in between, my weapons wouldn't aim right, or my shots wouldn't register hits... not sure which. I got my ship stuck up in the infrastructure at the repair depot before I could get repairs to see if it was game related or just or damage related...
I like the repair robots. I was able to land a few times and get repairs. But at one point I crashed and exploded... that was kinda fun. Very poor repair depot design... Which brings up autopilot.
If they are aiming for realism, you would have to have auto landing 100% at a repair depot. Just sayin... Have you noticed how twitchy the ship gets when trying to move really slow like for landing? My ship would get exponential steering, if I had to install it myself. But all that said, I like the way the Super Hornet flies. The game itself is coming along nicely. They are doing what they said they would, so I'm still eager to see more released.
I hope the AI is all that. If it is even just good I will be happy, but I'm hoping its stunningly good. And I don't mean just NPC type AI, but also for landing and takoffs. I always admired the auto land feature in the FREELANCER series. It's like self driving cars in space. Also when you approached the travel gates, it would steer you inside when you hit "dock". It wasn't a cut sceen in most cases either, though some where, most times it just took over your controls and landed you...
I really hope to see a lot of technology that is ahead of what we have now in real life...

Bronurstomp


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Sat 06 Feb, 2016 10:00 pm 
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hmm im not sure why the load out would cause any crashing. i actually finished all the missions in the Universe module with a modified Super Hornet yesterday without any issues. one thing i do know is that there are times when the servers go down and crash, that makes it look like the client is having frame rate issues. the fact is its the server is about to break and dosnt update the client fast enough, the result is either something that looks like a FPS drop or an out right crash. but with that being said, the only people who really know what causes bugs are the CIG guys lol. the worse case ive had with bugs regarding setting up and modifying your load out of your ship, is sometimes it not saving properly or not loading into the game and end up with stock load out anyways.

you dont HAVE to use auto landing at the cryastro repair stations. but you can enable it and use if you wish to. they do have exponential thrusters but not for the keyboards. the best you can get is using the precision mode (PRE) flight setting that cuts down on thruster usage for a safer flying experience. its not perfect but its better then the Space Combat Mode. (SCM). ( side note: tapping the key can help because it takes a small amount of time for your thrusters to come to full power so if you tap it you can get a lower power depending on when you take your finger off the key for a slower movement.) for exponential thruster flight you need either a joystick or a game pad because its digital, where a keyboards uses basically and on/off switch. in fact right now im playing around with the idea of hooking up a PC game pad to my x52 throttle so i have the little joystick to use the exponential thruster for better control. picked up a few used ones at a saint Vinnies the other day for $4 to see if i can get things to work right hehe.

i think from what ive seen about planetary landings, they are playing around with the idea of a auto landing sequence. probably for the large city time landing zones and/or military type landing areas... the more out of the way landing areas may be manual landing. probably to make them feel more backwater and poor or less technical. it will be interesting to see how they get this done though :P


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 08 Feb, 2016 11:07 am 
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It was probably just coincidence. It just seemed to be stable for a longer time when I did't go to the hangar before doing the Universe thing.

I wasn't aware of an auto landing feature. Is this something in place now? I knew there was a landing 'mode' but I never saw it do anything other than turn off my weapons. The few times I was able to land, it took a really long time going really really slow to just the right spot. Most times I would get almost into position, try to land, and my ship would flip over or slam into the landing pad and explode. Maybe I need to do a screenshot of the keyboard controls and print it out and tape it to my screen or something. My biggest problem I think, is that I can't touch-type, so I have to look down at the keyboard to try to find something besides the WASD keys, and then if I do hit the right key combination, try to get my fingers back on those keys, and by then something happens and I can't recover in time.

As far as the monitors versus a wearable display goes, I won't be buying any more "toys" in a while. I damaged my car in that snowstorm Friday. So I'll stay with the single 42" display for now. I'm not complaining mind you, it still looks great.
I just don't know how to switch views without crashing into something, or hitting some unknown function key. This interface needs a LOT of work, or no one is going to be able to play this game except for a bona-fide pilot, or die hard gamer with complex controllers/monitor set up. Right now, a keyboard, mouse and one monitor is really difficult.

Oh, and speaking of the missions, I still can't figure out if I "Have" these missions or not. Do you have to do something to get them or whats the deal? How do you know which arrays are done and which ones aren't? When you look at the missions screen is it supposed to be white or yellow? Which one means selected? Really? Red and green are not universal across the big pond? Do Brits go on red and stop on green? Do they use white and yellow signals?
At least on one occasion, I went to a Comm array, and killed off the pirates, and the guys keep asking me "hey where you going? Ok I guess we'll handle it." While I was trying to get close enough to EVA. And then one time, I never even left the cockpit and they thanked me for repairing it?? Maybe someone else was there and did it and I didn't see them? I suppose I should log into the test server and make some suggestions. If they could make it as simple as Freelancer was, maybe I could figure out wtf I was doing.
Oh, and how do you do the repair thing? Is there something that shows you where you have to go to do the repairs? Is there a <USE> thingy somewhere? I haven't been able to find a console or anything and after flying around the array for an hour I got bored and frustrated and gave up. Besides, if you are EVA, usually someone will come along and just blow up your ship anyway.
I also hope they figure out a way to save time getting to your ship. The whole, go to the console room, log in, select your ship, get out of there, find the right airlock, go through that whole process, find your ship, watch while the cutscene thing runs climbing into it... blah blah blah. I'm finding it less and less likely this will be my go-to game when it does get released. Way to much "work" to do when all I want to do is play. I get enough of work, um, at work lol. I mean I know it's not designed to be Angry birds, but wasting my time just to get to my ship seems counterproductive.

Sorry if I'm coming across like I'm bitching... It's frikken snowing again :( So I'm not in a great mood.
I really want this game to be fun. I'm hoping it will be once they fix some of this stuff.

Bronur


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 08 Feb, 2016 12:08 pm 
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as for auto landing. at least on my keyboard layout the N key gets you into landing mode. once you get close to a landing zone ( they will show up as green circle things ) hit your scroll wheel button or middle mouse button. to enable auto landing hit the M key to enable/disable auto landing. you should be able to see if auto landing in enabled on the HUD. once you get close to the landing zone, you will see a red line, follow it and once you get in range the auto landing will take over and land you... currently the only place i know that the auto landing feature works are at the cryastro stations. after repairs are over tap your strafe up key, at that point you will auto take off and then it will release your ship into your control, sort of like when you take off at the port.

the mission screen is in the F9 menu. so far there are the journal entries and i think the mission manager. the mission manager is the larger box to the left of the journal box. once you get into the mission box, in order to enable a mission, click the circle to the left until its highlighted. you can also see completed missions under 'completed' on the left. to see how an active mission is going, click the mission and you should have details on the right. once you select a mission you will see way points on your main hud. when you complete a missions such as turning on a com array it will disappear. to complete ALL the missions that i know about, you have to do a com array missions, go to the ICC station and pick up the associated mission, ( usually a unidentified signal or a distress call ) go to the location check it out, ( fight pirates, or vandul ) then EVA to the beacon and click the red button on it. ( you will hear a beeping noise and see a red light the closer you get to the beacon.) WARNING, some of these missions will try to ambush you once you turn off the beacon, especially the Vandul one, so i like to find a safe place to park my ship close by so i can get to it, and get it started up before being attacked lol. once the mission is done, you head off and do another Com array and repeat the process.

if you are around a beacon when someone else turns it on, you will get credit for it and you can go directly to the ICC mission.

to do the repair station, all you have to do is land on one of the landing pads and your ship should automatically be repaired. the bad thing is, for some reason it dosnt refill your quantum fuel or resupply missiles. i believe this is a known bug they are working on.

i hate the asshats who blow up your ship for the hell of it, i think my favorite pass time will bounty hunting these guys once they get the monetary and bounty system up and going hehehe what ever you do, dont go to the security station, it is an active free fire zone (also the first person shooter area ) so everyone hankering for a fight has been heading to that area. it seems its the local lawless space in the universe at this point.

i dont mind the getting into ship thing myself. i kind of like how they are trying to make it seamless from start to finish. but i dont die TOO often :P


right now, the learning curve is really steep for SC. they are aware of this and have already talked about how it will be made easier especially for those with starter ships. then later as you get used to the systems, you will be able to upgrade your ship computers and ship parts for more complex functions. i know i spend a lot of time messing around in SC so for me i just kind of picked things up as they come along. but i dont know everything about everything still.

Justin my oldest boy has been playing with me. just got him setup on team speak last night. if you see us on. come join us on some Vandul swarm hehe. im trying to get him to build up some REC so he can rent another ship after the free fly is over.


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Wed 10 Feb, 2016 2:27 pm 
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Ok, well, like I said, once I get my car fixed, I will decide on what to do towards this game. If I'm going to play, I want to be effective at whatever I decide to do. So if it will support a VR headset, then I'll do my best to evaluate the one's available. I think the Oculus Rift is due out in the Summer. The Vuzix iWear is available now, if you consider 2-4 weeks delivery 'now'. I would like to see what controllers are supported by Windows. I'm used to KB mouse combo for Freelancer. I also don't own any console game system, so I don't know if I would be any good with one of those type controllers.

I've seen some pretty fancy controls in some of the SC videos that the Devs use. If anyone has any suggestions, I would like to hear them.

I'll try to get on tonight, and spend some time with the game and maybe try some of the controls you mentioned. It's important to feel like I'm accomplishing something, so if I can make some progress on a mission, I'll be happier. I need to really learn the default KB layouts, since it will revert back to that on every update, which means I can't customize it until it gets released, and they stop forcing me to delete the USER subdirectory. I know you said you don;t "HAVE" to, but my luck, if I tried to keep it, it would hose the game. I'm thinking back to my idea of printing a screenshot of the KB interface screen, and hanging it somewhere convenient...

Hope to see you guys in the 'verse!

Bronur


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 15 Feb, 2016 12:03 pm 
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Didn't see anyone around this weekend. I am still having some stability issues with the game. I think tonight when I get home, I am going to completely uninstall the game from my machine and start fresh. Maybe that will help.
My biggest issue seems to be with the weapon load outs on my Superhornet. When I try to load up all lvl2 weapons and go to EA, it takes like 5 minutes or more to load the game. Then, all the weapons are back to non-gimbaled laser cannons with one repeater. Ugh.
Finally, after rebooting, I went to the hangar, looked at my ship and could see what guns were mounted. So then I went to the holo, changed them around, and went back to look at my ship, and most of the changes showed up, except it removed the gimbals and one of the wing guns.
I went back to the holo, and sure enough was the same there, so I removed everything, carefully remounted all the gimbals, put 3 Badgers on, one on each wing and one under center, and then put 2 Bulldogs(lvl1) on the top center gimbal.
Went to look at my ship, and lo and behold, there they all were.
THEN I went to EA and started a public Vandull swarm co-op game. This time I was able to play with 2 other players all the way to lvl 14. Not bad, made myself about 2700 REC.
But during the fighting, one of the gimbals got stuck, and would not pivot so I lost half my firepower for a while. I looked to see if there was damage, but didn't see anything red in the paper doll. Shrug, whatever, once I died, and respawned, I had all the gimbals working again.
Oh and I just remember something else. In the default, which I'm using, the center mouse button (3) is set to lock missiles, and then launch them. But every so often, unpredictably, it instead changes my camera to external while I am trying to fire a missile, which is press and hold middle mouse. Weird huh?
But again back to the topic of control and display. My rear view camera doesn't seem to function, and after an hour or so my mouse hand, fingers, start to cramp up and I need to take a break. I hope other activities besides dog-fighting, are a little less repetitive type actions, or I'm going to have to ration my playing time in the 'verse. Or find a more user friendly controller.

Oh and btw... BRRRR... it was -9 driving to work this morning. PDT_Armataz_01_19 Neg nine degrees! Now it's snowing again.... why oh why did I leave Texas....

Brrrrrronur


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Fri 19 Feb, 2016 1:40 pm 
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Seems I'm talking to myself.. oh well...

Here's my plan if I don't find a decent VR headset...


Image


Bronur


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Fri 19 Feb, 2016 2:35 pm 
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hmm. i havnt seen anyone on my list when i get on, so probably a timing issue. Justin and i even hung out on teamspeak for awhile to see if anyone would show up. we did some multi crew stuff and some missions. the mission system is still a bit buggy. only 1 person has to do the com arrays, but it seems we both have to get out and hit the beacon missions. it was kind of cool though, we would swap off piloting and the gunner seat. needless to say, i fly better :P

thats one hell of a wall of screens! lol. i would like to do a 3 monitor setup eventually. but i probably wont try until the game gets way more developed then it is.


there are still a lot of bugs about the holotable. im hoping to see some fixes in the 2.2 build that will be coming out soon. they mentioned today that there was going to be a crap ton of fixes in this next patch, but they didnt say what exactly.

i get what you saying about repetitive actions can cause pain.
i have a x52 hotas stick/throttle setup after just a short time using the twist action on the stick my wrist is shot. mainly due to injury and years of abuse in the construction trade. so have been using my sidewinder precision pro 2 stick and its much better. ( less spring tension.)

a new problem with the addition of afterburner ( to engage after burner i have it setup on the boost key but right now its mandatory double tap. meaning i have to hit the key twice to engage afterburn) i am having problems because after i hit the key, in racing now you have to hold the button down threw the whole race. after about 3 races my thumb starts hurting bad. (before when there was only boost, you just hit boost to quickly change directions and let off.)

since you are a mouse and kboard player all these years, its hard to guess what controller would be best for you. being that ive had wrist issues for a long time now, ive been using trackballs for decades. that allows me to comfortably rest my wrist on a surface and just use my fingers for movements. i havnt used a regular mouse in forever, so im not sure if a trackball would help the problems or not.

right now, im considering using the hotas setup on the left side. and my sidewinder on the right. so its sort of a dual stick setup. the problem is it takes up a lot of room on the desk. the benefits that i can see from this setup would be i would still have my throttle stand, i would be able to use the stick fine strafing control and it has a shit ton of buttons for other functions. also, i could move the boost button the the trigger and it may relieve some pain there. and the controls on my right stick ( sidewinder) would remain the same. i will probably wait till 2.2 comes out before i work on this config just in case any control changes come in this patch.

if your not interested in spending a crap ton of money on controllers to try out. i often go to second hand places, ( here we have goodwill and saint vinnies ) its usually older crap and some times they dont have anything, but i just run threw see whats there, if nothing i leave. ( or browse the book section.) i picked my sidewinder (brand new condition) for $15 and i picked up a game pad for PC for $3.99 (im still planning on building my own franken controller setup in the future lol) there might be some options there to try out. if one strikers your fancy, then you can look at a more solid new version to purchase.


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 22 Feb, 2016 8:42 am 
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Good idea on looking into a used controller, Joystick etc.... I think there's a Salvation Army in Spencer, and I know there's a Goodwill in Palmer, each is about 1/2 hour drive so not too bad.

I finally got all the way through the PI mission. It took a good 15-20 minutes of exploring the station to find the right green thingy to <<USE>>
Still trying to figure out the com arrays missions. Where is the control panel located? Is it inside somewhere?


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 22 Feb, 2016 9:19 am 
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yea. the panel is inside. you will see an opening about the same level as where the solor panel arms attach. you go inside, EVA down to where the panel is. remember, if you have the mission activated, you should see a blue mission icon. once you complete that aspect of the mission it should go away.


oh good news! i guess when they bring out 2.2 (hopefully this week) they are including the first iteration of the bounty system. so for those people who like to grief. if they do it too often then they will be shown as red players. if you see a red player, either blow them up or run. hehe... bounty hunting anyone? PDT_Armataz_01_36


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 22 Feb, 2016 7:43 pm 
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Woot I'm in.
But if you bounty hunt, wont you eventually turn red?
There's the rub. Maybe if they can say if you shoot red you don't turn red but if you shoot green you do?
And if you get destroyed while red, do you then turn green? It would have to, unless they are ready for a shit ton more persistence in the P.U..

A little bug reporting, maybe you can pass it along.

I selected Universe and went downstairs to the ship selection screen. Before pressing <<USE>>, I hit ESC and went to my hanger.
Once in the hanger, I changed weapons around on first the Super Hornet, then the Ghost Hornet. When I exited the sound and video froze.
After restarting, I went to the hanger first, found the weapon load outs remained where I had set them before it crashed. (So the crash could have been a connectivity issue.)
So then I went to the Universe, went to the terminal, and got my Super Hornet. It had all the weapons so I got in and went to a few comm stations to fight the pirates. After a few iterations, I went to the repair depot and got fixed up and rearmed my missiles.
Did that a few more times, had a collision, and lost my wing weapons, 4 badgers. Went to the repair depot and they didn't replace my weapons.
Went to the hanger, then back to universe and had weapons back. Did it again, one wing and it repaired the wing but not the weapons.


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Mon 22 Feb, 2016 8:29 pm 
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hmm that is an odd bug.

the game crashing going to the hanger i get a lot. not sure what the issue is on that one.

for me, when i repair at the repair station, i usually get my weapons, but i dont get my missiles replaced LOL. but, for the most part i just play with a stock ship in the PU and not modified. i wonder if it has something to do with having modified weapons and the repair station dosnt know what to do so it just put nothing back. i will pass it a long and test it myself.


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Sun 22 Jan, 2017 8:45 pm 
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Still kind of sitting on the sidelines with this game. I have watched a bit of the stuff that SC puts out, but they sure do put out a lot of fluff!
I came across this on amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Saitek- ... 026NT7T6F2

That is the Logitech G Saitek Pro Flight X56 Rhino HOTAS, and I think I might go with something like this, as well as a new chair to match it, once I do get into this game.

Blackhawk, do you know if the game supports it yet? Or if not, will it you think?


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 Post subject: Re: VR Head gear or multiple monitors?
PostPosted: Fri 10 Feb, 2017 9:08 pm 
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yea the game supports all sort of controller options right now. the thing to keep in mind though, is the controls are still under going changes. so this wont stay the same from patch to patch.


right now, im useing a X52 throttle with a sidewinder precision pro 2 stick. a lot of people are using a dual stick system, one for pitch and yaw. another stick for strafing. and a throttle of course. ( some people use the second stick for throttle though.) a lot of people are recommending the saitech T16000 stick, i guess it uses the same hall sensors as the thrust master warthog. ( and it can be fitted to be left hand.) maybe when im not into the racing thing so much i will try a duel stick setup. there seems to be a lot of benefits to it.


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